let's address the flood of
> hitchhikers out there! Do we really need more???
>
> --Amanda from Seattle

Just like stamps, boxes, clues, and locations chosen for boxes
there can be 'crappy' hitch hikers and wonderful hitch hikers. It
has everything to do with the thought or work going into the HH.

My kids like making HH's because it is easier for them than
planting a box. Great for them, too bad for the finders. I am less
likely to plant a HH unless it is something special. Still, I would
rather find a crappy HH made by a kid than none at all.

Happy Mom and I have made a couple of really nicely packaged
HH's that we are quite proud of. The complexity of the stamp or
the packaging or the concept is what makes it great to us (at
least from a creator's perspective).

It does seem like there are an abundance of them in the NW
though. I think that those folks who get to travel the country
frequently should try to gather them up from one particular area
and freely deposit them in far flung areas when they can. You
know, Amanda, it was good to see some of the east coast sig
stamps in a HH log book that I recently came across which you
were responsible for transporting across the continent. As long
as we keep getting blessed by your efforts, I say everyone should
keep the HH's coming.

Thats my opinion.

Nailhead

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda Arkebauer
" wrote:
>...
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
> ....

I disagree. Out of over 200 finds, we have encountered only 5
hitchhikers. For us, that's only about one every 5 months.

You could consider them "lazy-boys'" boxes, but when we've made HHs,
they have a story to them which gives them a reason to travel (if you
ever encounter Peter J. McGuire, you'll never think us lazy if you
actually read his story. Writing it took much longer and was more work
than writing clues). Also, we put them in their own box, as most boxes
around here aren't large enough to hold a second book etc.

If you have too many HHs on the west coast, send them off to far away
places so that the rest of us can enjoy finding them. :)

~ Aili
in CT

I like finding hitchhikers! What I find most interesting is seeing
where they have been. I think the most interesting stamp I ever saw
was the San Marco H.H. While I agree that we need more boxes, at
least in Louisiana we do. Why should this require fewer hitchhikers?

Jim Dillon

P 6, F 7, X 0

A HITCHHIKER IN EVERY BOX, and one in transit

Hitchhiker's used to be a rare treat, now they are epidemic!

Trial n Error

----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2003 6:38 PM
Subject: [LbNA] Too Many Hitchhikers


> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...I have been having
> discussions with other letterboxers (off of the board) and that has
> been a major topic.
>
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
>
> I know that you can just leave the hitchhiker for someone else to
> deal with, but I find that hitchhikers are the Lazy Man's letterboxes.
>
> All someone has to do is get the stamp (often not even a hand carved
> stamp!) and put it in some zip-locks with a logbook. No clues to
> write, no box to buy. Very Lazy.
>
> Forget about trashing the geocachers, let's address the flood of
> hitchhikers out there! Do we really need more???
>
> --Amanda from Seattle
>
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

I can see how if your are finding one in almost every box
then "mystic" is gone. I hear complaints of too few also. I've only
found a few but it doesn't bother me. I wonder if there is a third
group who think the number of HHs is just right. Perhaps only
Goldilocks and the bears know.


--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda Arkebauer
" wrote:
> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...I have been having
> discussions with other letterboxers (off of the board) and that
has
> been a major topic.
>
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
>
> I know that you can just leave the hitchhiker for someone else to
> deal with, but I find that hitchhikers are the Lazy Man's
letterboxes.
>
> All someone has to do is get the stamp (often not even a hand
carved
> stamp!) and put it in some zip-locks with a logbook. No clues to
> write, no box to buy. Very Lazy.
>
> Forget about trashing the geocachers, let's address the flood of
> hitchhikers out there! Do we really need more???
>
> --Amanda from Seattle

> I know that you can just leave the hitchhiker for someone else to
> deal with, but I find that hitchhikers are the Lazy Man's letterboxes.

Which is a good point. I've always thought the world (or at least
letterboxing) would be better off if we all just ignored what we didn't
like. I mean, I ignore the "geojunk" I find in geocaches and letterboxes
(that I believe geocachers leave in them) and that seems to work out
(sorry, I just love that word, and had to find a way to use it ... I
really have nothing against geocaching, but ain't that a pretty word ...)

Of course, onto the specific point -- I wish everyone was as "lazy"
as to create something like the Hatbox Caper and the 9 hitchhikers
that are part of the bargain. It took me alot of effort to do that,
and I never considered it lazy. I really think its kinda cool, and an
example of a way to turn the putative ubiquitous hitchhiker lemons into
lemonade (putative, ubiquitous, or otherwise). As with all things,
there is the good, the bad, and the ugly (the sentence before being an
example of the "ugly"), and sometimes "in moderation" makes sense,
sometimes geojunk dilutes the beauty, but we all agree that unagi is
the best sushi.

So, thats my final answer in this thread. Can't wait to download my
mail on the morrow ;-)

Cheers

Maybe we need a Hitchhiker Transport Service (HTS) to move them from West to
East and East to West, not to mention the overseas and downunder cycle.

Are there any UPS or FedEx couriers out there?

Trial n Error

----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Tuesday, January 14, 2003 7:00 PM
Subject: [LbNA] Re: Too Many Hitchhikers


> I can see how if your are finding one in almost every box
> then "mystic" is gone. I hear complaints of too few also. I've only
> found a few but it doesn't bother me. I wonder if there is a third
> group who think the number of HHs is just right. Perhaps only
> Goldilocks and the bears know.
>
>
> --- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda Arkebauer
> " wrote:
> > Are there too many hitchhikers out there...I have been having
> > discussions with other letterboxers (off of the board) and that
> has
> > been a major topic.
> >
> > It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
> >
> > I know that you can just leave the hitchhiker for someone else to
> > deal with, but I find that hitchhikers are the Lazy Man's
> letterboxes.
> >
> > All someone has to do is get the stamp (often not even a hand
> carved
> > stamp!) and put it in some zip-locks with a logbook. No clues to
> > write, no box to buy. Very Lazy.
> >
> > Forget about trashing the geocachers, let's address the flood of
> > hitchhikers out there! Do we really need more???
> >
> > --Amanda from Seattle
>
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...
>
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.

I must be looking in all of the wrong boxes!!! :(

Haven't found a hitchhiker in ages...I found "Traveling Man" HH 60
letterboxes and a month and a half ago!

dvn2r ckr

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "dvn2rckr "
wrote:
> > Are there too many hitchhikers out there...
> >
> > It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
>
> I must be looking in all of the wrong boxes!!! :(
>
> Haven't found a hitchhiker in ages...I found "Traveling Man" HH 60
> letterboxes and a month and a half ago!
>
> dvn2r ckr

Oops--I totally forgot, I found one of my own HHs on a recent
letterboxing trip (My Favorite Things) last week. I only took it so
I could fix it at home (maintenance reasons--another reason to NOT
use Speedball's white carving medium from Michaels--it falls apart
almost instantly!!!) otherwise it would have stayed there for the
next lucky finder instead. Still need more sleep...but still
looking forward to finding other folks' hitchhikers, too! ;)

Greetings,

--- "Amanda Arkebauer "
wrote:
> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...

I'm going to offer some help on this. The next time
you find a HH, send me an email, I'll send you my
snail mail address, and we'll turn it loose here in
New England! :-)

In about 125 finds, we've only got four hitchhikers.

I'll throw my two cents in for what it's worth.

Out of the first 100 letterboxes I found, I didn't find a single
hitchhiker. Out of the second set of 100 letterboxes I found, six
were hitchhikers. And from the third set of 100 letterboxes I've
found, ten were hitchhikers.

I'm kind of torn on the subject--I think hitchhikers provide a very
good 'service' in a sense. It allows people like me to see some
signature stamps from the east coast I'd otherwise never get a chance
to see. It allows people on the east coast the ability to find
a "Ryan box" without actually having to go to the west coast.

And a well-crafted hitchhiker can be a great find. I created a
hitchhiker named "Joe" a while back because he "escaped" from prison
and was running from the law. A cute little story for why the guy
was "on the run" and jumping from box to box. (Even better, it was a
follow up to my "Murder At Gabriel Park!" series, and I thought the
tie-in was pretty clever.) Amanda from Seattle created an Alfred
Hitchcock hitchhiker--how cool is THAT? Anyone with the word 'hitch'
in his name OUGHT to be a hitchhiker! And the K-Martha hitchhiker
has such a wonderful history behind it. These kind of hitchhikers I
think are an absolute joy to find!

But I also think a lot--possibily even MOST--of hitchhikers are
created out of laziness so the creator doesn't have to find a hiding
spot, create clues, and so on. Some have been so lazy, they don't
even carve their own stamp but run out to the store to buy them!
Frankly, I don't think it reflects well on the person who'd hide such
a box, but they'll do it anyway. (I haven't actually found any of
those, but I've heard about them and if I ever DO come across one, I
will NOT pick it up! A store-bought stamp in a regular letterbox I
frown at, but putting one as a hitchhiker I think is unforgiveable!)

But the bottom line for me is that hitchhikers used to be a rare
treat that were a joy to find. Now they're a dime a dozen and I
don't really get too excited about finding them anymore. I've even
been heard to groan at finding a couple of them, sad to say.

There might be some merit to the argument that some areas are
overpopulated while others are underserved, which could explain the
varity of opinions people are sure to express. Hitchhikers certainly
aren't distributed evenly, although out here in the west I tend to
think there's too many and would like to see a halt to new ones--at
least for awhile until they move on or die of natural causes.

I hid a few a while back before I had found ANY hitchhikers because I
thought there was a severe lack of them at the time. And that was my
primary reason FOR hiding them, but I really didn't get a whole lot
of satisfaction out of hiding them. For one thing, I'd say at least
half the time they go somewhere, I don't even hear about it. I have
no way to verify if the box is still alive and well or DOA. If the
box travels particularly far, I'll never be able to go back and see
all the wonderful things people have written in it. Basically,
they're the least favorite boxes that I've hidden!

Anyhow, I think everyone has the right to hide a few--regardless of
whether your area is saturated or not--if for no other reason than to
hope they head far away and you can "show off" your stamps in areas
you'd otherwise never get to visit.

Beyond that, unless there's a good reason for why it should be a
hitchhiker rather than a regular letterbox, I'd rather see them as
regular letterboxes. Then I can actively hunt them down rather than
find them by blind luck, know what I mean?

I washed my hands of hiding hitchhikers over a year ago due to
oversaturation--with one exception only because the stamp was of a
scummy looking person that really DID look like a hitchhiker--it
would have been criminal NOT to make him a hitchhiker! But you can
bet I won't be hiding more than one hitchhiker for every 50 or so
regular letterboxes that I hide. That seems like about the right
about to me: One hitchhiker for every 50 boxes would be perfect.
Fully 2% of the letterboxes out there. Everyone will have a
different opinion on that, I suppose, where some will say that's too
much and others say it's not enough, and my opinion on that matter
isn't more or less right than anyone else. But seeing as I'm
currently finding hitchhikers in about 10% of the boxes I find,
that's about five times past my tolerance level for them!

Anyhow, I think I need to add to my Creating Great Boxes webpage and
add a special section about hitchhikers. =) My goodness, how did I
miss a category that large?!

And since we're on the subject of hitchhikers--I haven't heard
anything about ANY of the ones I've hidden for at least six months
now. If anyone has any information about their current locations or
travels, please let me know via e-mail! You can see all of my
hitchhikers (and their known travels!) at
http://www.geocities.com/rscarpen/Lb/Hitch

-- Ryan, voting no on new hitchhikers....

I've created the first (to my knowledge) HH Brothel, which I will be
placing in Nevada in March. Hopefully, this will solve the problem
of HH saturation, as HH's leave the NW en masse on convention
business.
~R.

There is also the PO Letterbox - the one only HHs can find - you can
send them there:

http://home.agalis.net/bcostley/Letterbox/pobox.htm

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, Mike Schneider
wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> --- "Amanda Arkebauer "
> wrote:
> > Are there too many hitchhikers out there...
>
> I'm going to offer some help on this. The next time
> you find a HH, send me an email, I'll send you my
> snail mail address, and we'll turn it loose here in
> New England! :-)
>
> In about 125 finds, we've only got four hitchhikers.
> From looking through Wanda and Pete's HH site, it does
> seem that the other coast has more of them than we do.
> It also seems that, in order to find HHs more often,
> you need to hit the boxes out here within the first
> few weeks, because folks race right out to get the new
> boxes, and often leave suprises behind.
>
> Mike S.
>
> =====
> The more you love, the more you can love. And the more intensely
you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a
person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are
decent and just. - Lazarus Long
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com

I guess I don't mind hitchhikers. I remember the time when I would get
envious by the East Coast posts before I found my first hitchhiker, Old
Glory, out here in the Pacific NW. I've definitey come across a few
hitchhikers since then and one of my favorites was placed by none other
than, ahem, Amanda from Seattle -- Hitch! It does seem like there are
tons more out there, but I don't mind them one way or another.
Sometimes it's fun to take them "visiting" to other letterboxes before I
ultimately place them for someone else to find. Flutterby has fluttered
by my way twice and I enjoyed that..

I suppose it's a matter of preference and the more you letterbox, the
more likely it is you'll run across hitchhikers along the way. I have
never made a hitchhiker myself and do not plan to. There are enough out
there and the people who like to place them seem pretty profuse about
it, so let them go for it. I'll just feel lucky when I stumble upon one
in my travels. I can deal with it. They are no bother to me.

Best regards,

Amanda Briles
The Paisley Orca

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda Arkebauer
" wrote:
> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...
>
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
>
>
> --Amanda from Seattle

And yet... Pink Trotters has found 134 boxes and not a HH at any
of them. How can this be? she should stamp her feet in protest. She
has shared and been given HH but never once a delight at finding one
in the woods.
This whole discussion went through the boards a couple years ago
and I'm not suprised it has popped up again I make some of mine with
the purpose of being sent home when the book is full then they will
retire. The books are quite interesting as we all know and a great
way to see far distant boxes we will never get to.
Leader of the Pack

Hi Amanda,

I have done over 200 letterboxes and have found only 6 hitchhikers.
That is less than one in every 30 boxes. So I say no, there are not
too many hitchhikers out there. Perhaps it depends where you live.
I live in north east where there are probably 1000 letterboxes within
a 1 hour drive of my house.

One of the beauties of letterboxing is that it is an unregulated
hobby. Everyone can do it at their own pace and interest level.
People enjoy it for different reasons. I agree with you that making
a hitchhiker box can be pretty easy. Buy a stamp & a notebook, put
them in a zip lock bag and voila! instant letterbox. I guess I would
say, so what? Some people enjoy spending a great deal of time
writing the perfect clues (thank you very much to those people!),
some people enjoy finding the perfect spot for the letterbox, others
enjoy carving the perfect stamp. However you enjoy the hobby, the
key word is ENJOY. If people enjoy putting out hitchhikers then they
should put out hitchhikers. As you mentioned, there is no rule that
says if a person finds a HH they have to take it or even that they
have to log into it. The hitchhiker can be totally ignore if the
person wishes as if it wasn't even there.

The two points I would like to leave you with are:

1. I only find HH about 1 every 2 months. I am still thrilled when
I find one.
2. I hate to see restrictions put on letterboxing. I guess you could
call me a bleeding heart liberal, but I think the sport of
letterboxing should be unregulated so that everyone can enjoy the
hobby in the manner that suits them best. Letterboxing is fun.
Let's see that it stays that way.

thank you for letting me ramble,

Janet aka moonstone_baby



--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda Arkebauer
" wrote:
> Are there too many hitchhikers out there...I have been having
> discussions with other letterboxers (off of the board) and that has
> been a major topic.
>
> It seems like every box we find has a hitchhiker in it.
>
> I know that you can just leave the hitchhiker for someone else to
> deal with, but I find that hitchhikers are the Lazy Man's
letterboxes.
>
> All someone has to do is get the stamp (often not even a hand
carved
> stamp!) and put it in some zip-locks with a logbook. No clues to
> write, no box to buy. Very Lazy.
>
> Forget about trashing the geocachers, let's address the flood of
> hitchhikers out there! Do we really need more???
>
> --Amanda from Seattle

One more thing I would like to add.

The first letterbox I ever made was a hitchhiker. I was new to the
sport of letterboxing and wanted to contribute in some way. I spent
a great deal of time carving the stamp for my hitchhiker and was very
proud of how it turned out. I wrote a little story line to go with
my cute stamp then found a nice spot to release my creation. I had a
hard time parting with this, my first stamp, and it a little puppy to
boot. None the less I found a letterbox in a really neat spot where
I thought my little hitchhiking pup would like to wait for his first
ride.

Image my joy when a short time later I got a wonderful email from the
finder telling me that it was their first hitchhiker and how much
they loved my little carved dog.

I got one more email from someone else who found it. That was back in
April of last year. I have not heard of my little traveller's
whereabouts since. I am sad to have lost this, my first letterbox
and first carved stamp. Yet that is the risk one faces when creating
a hitchhiker.

Janet

Sounds like it is definitely a regional thing... I've found 3
hitchikers, but all at the same place, so only 1 of 49 boxes found
had HH. I never really thought of them as "the lazy man's
letterbox", rather just a fun variance from the routine box.

I would tend to agree with something Ryan said about not getting as
much satisfaction when I place a hitchhiker... I like putting the
whole box together, including finding the spot and writing the
clues. And then you have the issue that once you release your HH,
you may never hear anything about it, since many people (most?) do
not take the time to e-mail when they find it.

But, on the other hand, it is also kind of a challenge... a little
gamble that maybe, just maybe, you will put out your hitcher and
somewhere down the road you will hear of his whereabouts and his
travels... or better yet, you may stumble across him in a box
yourself.

But it is just like everything else in this hobby, we all have
different aspects we like and some we don't particularly care about.
The good thing is that without a lot of rules, it is flexible enough
to take what you like and ignore what you don't.

When I first read the subject line "too many hitchhikers" I couldn't
help but think of a song about having "too much fun"

Too much fun? What's that mean?
It's like too much money, there's no such thing
It's like a girl too pretty, with too much class
Being too lucky, a car too fast
No matter what they say I've done
I ain't never had too much fun...

I still think finding a HH is fun!

Deb (SpringChick)

> I've created the first (to my knowledge) HH Brothel, which I will
> be placing in Nevada in March.

Oh, gosh, that is TOO funny.... =)

-- Ryan